From: Brian Holtz [brian@holtz.org]
Sent: Monday, January 30, 2006 9:00 AM
To: 'Minarchists@yahoogroups.com'
Cc: 'marketliberal@yahoogroups.com'
Subject: Re: FW: making the LP Platform safe for minarchism
Paul Ireland wrote:
PI> The premise of libertarianism is that we own ourselves <PI
The pilot owns his plane, too. Can you give us a list of all the different kinds of ownership, or do you just invent new ones when you're losing an argument?
PI> nothing inside our body has any claim to our body. To claim otherwise is to claim a tapeworm has more rights to your body than you do. <PI
A tapeworm does not meet anyone's criteria for personhood.
PI> We are born with rights and not a second before. <PI
Wow, so you can look at the videotape of my daughter's birth and tell me the second at which she acquired the right to life?  My camcorder shoots at 30 frames per second -- do you think you could even narrow it down to the individual frame in which she became a person?  I'd like to send printouts of that one to the grandparents.
PI> Even if a fully functional human being capable of thought, speech, and written communication were to find themselves inside the body of another human being, they would have absolutely no rights what-so-ever; not even the right to life itself. <PI
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proof_by_assertion
 
By the way, is being inside another's epidermis the only place or circumstance in which a person magically loses all his rights, or do you have a list you can share with us persons who would like to avoid all such places?  If the person is outside the epidermis but physically and uniquely dependent for life on a connection to or through the epidermis that the mother voluntarily arranged, can she still kill the person? Do conjoined twins have the right to kill each other?  Given your language about "absolutely no rights whatsoever", do they have even the right to vote?
 
What is it about a mother's epidermis that gives it its magical rights-nullifying properties?  If all your skin is eventually replaced by grafts donated from the same donor, does he have the right to kill you?  If a babysitter surgically acquires a pouch or skin flap and sews a client's baby inside it, can she be prosecuted only for kidnapping but not for suffocating the baby?
PI> Trying to compare an airplane to your own body is ridiculous.  I won't let myself get caught up in such a ridiculous and worthless analogy. <PI
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_pleading: "a form of spurious argumentation alleging a need to apply additional considerations without proper criticism of these considerations themselves".
 
And yet, four paragraphs later, you make the mistake of trying to answer the airplane analogy:
PI> anyone on the airplane has a right to life, and the right to enforce the contract they made when they bought their ticket to be taken all the way to thier destination. <PI
Bzzzt. My question was about "a person who involuntarily finds himself in my plane".  To play again, please insert another token.
 
And thanks for sparing us all the embarrassment of watching you try to save your tandem skydiving analogy from my earlier evisceration of it.
 
Brian Holtz
Libertarian candidate for Congress, CA14 (Silicon Valley) http://marketliberal.org
blog: http://knowinghumans.net