From: Brian Holtz [brian@holtz.org]
Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 6:37 PM
Subject: RE: Candidates - RE: Best LP issue: fascism or entitlements?
The law specifies pre-funding.    It requires an annual premium. The "ramping tax rate" does not change that requirement.  
There are also laws requiring that Congress shall pass a budget before the start of each fiscal year.
You say that Congress intended to under-fund the program from the beginning.   
I didn't say they intended specifically to underfund the program.  I said they self-servingly set up a program in which each cohort funds the previous cohort, instead of funding itself. They thus established the problematic pyramid-like nature of the program from the very beginning. 
If they did,  they were stupid to specify mortality tables in the very law,   because nobody could prove the under-funding without using mortality tables. 
There were no actual mortality tables in the law. Again, you're confusing a legislative fig leaf with actual legislative machinery.  In this case, the actual legislative machinery was the ramping schedule of contributions.
The ramping tax rate may show an intention to transfer money from one generation to another. 
I don't see how it could not show such an intention.
 Yet, that has nothing to do with pre-funding. 
It has everything to do with the sort of pre-funding that I earlier specified:
To clarify, "pay as you go" in the context of SS means that a given cohort's benefits are not paid entirely from its contributions, but rather rely at least in part on the contributions of later cohorts. "Pre-funded" means that a cohort's benefits would indeed be paid entirely from its contributions.
You continue:
If they did not include the "premium provision" for  legal reasons, what possible use would that provision serve?  If obeyed, the provision would guarantee pre-funding.  Yet if Congress did not intend to pre-fund the program, why did they include the appropriation provision?
To mislead people.  Legislators do not always reveal their true intentions in the language of the laws they pass.
I do not support the status quo.  I would like to end social security completely.  The program you recommend, however, seems to increase government power, rather than reduce it.  
Then why is it advocated by opponents of government power, and opposed by proponents of government power?
It does not further the ideal that SS was wrong in any way. 
Sure it does: by moving the system roughly half-way to one in which benefits are 1) pre-funded by actual accounts and not just government promises, 2) funded for each cohort by the contributions of that cohort, and 3) are paid from balances kept by name as the personal inheritable property of the beneficiary. Adopting these principles now clearly implies that SS was wrong not to adopt them then.
 
Indeed, as defenders of SS and government power rightly fear, even a limited system of personal accounts would soon result in the dismantling of SS.  Your current annual SS statement doesn't compare your returns in the system to alternative investments, but future such statements would show that contributions to personal accounts have better returns than the traditional system. Voters will quickly demand that their entire payroll tax be deposited in their personal accounts. This is the nightmare of the socialists who devised Social Security as "social insurance" that allows them to engage in arbitrary social engineering by tinkering with benefit and contribution rules. When SS becomes just mandatory retirement saving, there won't be anything "social" about it any more.
 
I'm stunned that you could oppose the only politically-viable rollback of America's most successful effort at socialism merely on the grounds that a) it doesn't also make retirement saving voluntary on day 1, and b) rent-seekers will complain that their windfalls have been taken from them.
It divides the electorate in half; those who rely on government payments, and those who profit from government tax breaks.  
The division will be between those cohorts and groups whose returns from the system are better than private savings would provide, versus those whose returns are worse.  Making this division clearer IS A GOOD THING.  Socialism can only succeed under the illusion that almost everyone benefits from it.  Privatizing SS destroys that illusion.
Everybody becomes more dependent on the government, not more free. 
The plan trades 1) an unfunded promise by the government to tax my children on my behalf for 2) a personal inheritable account in my name that pre-funds my benefits.  It's untenable to say such a trade makes me "more dependent on the government".
 People should not have to advance their economic interests through politics.  
If politics is how one's economic interests are being attacked, then politics is how to defend them. Libertarians recognize the clear moral distinction between using politics to keep what is yours, versus using politics to take what is someone else's.
Do you really think my children should have to decide to opt-in or opt-out of the government program?  
Such a choice is better than the status quo. Personal SS accounts are obviously the only politically viable alternative to the status quo.  I can only see one good reason to oppose such a plan on your style of hypothetical political calculation: if the Republicans succeed in rolling back the socialization of the retirement industry, that would seriously blunt one of the primary LP critiques of the Republican Party.  But since I put America's interests ahead of the LP's, that doesn't worry me at all.
BH:  Such comparisons with Nazis and fascists are specious, for reasons I've described before: 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/marketliberal/message/499 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/marketliberal/message/495

HH: Are you sure those are the right two message numbers for that subject? 
Yes, fascism is a prominent subject of both posts.